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spinning weight for height at Celtic...why?

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Valenti View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Valenti Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: spinning weight for height at Celtic...why?
    Posted: 2/22/12 at 8:54am


Im sure ill get a lot of dumb responses to this but....If NO sanctioning body that holds a World Heavy Events Chamoionships allows the spinning gaynes that is the weight for height in America...why does the Celtic Classic.

If our athletes for worlds come from our Celtic rankings shouldnt we contest the event the same way we do at worlds?
Why send athletes who have 17' spins but only 15' stands. If we switched the rankings for Celtic it would give us a better field of throwers to send to Worlds.

thoughts..ramblings?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote agm_ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 2/22/12 at 9:13am
What's the purpose of an American championships? If it's primarily to pick the team for the worlds, don't spin. If it has its own value as the premier event in the US, then as long as spinning remains popular in the US, spin away at Celtic.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sean Betz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 2/22/12 at 10:53am

It is a good question.  I believe there are a few reasons for the spin being allowed at Celtic.

- It is allowed at most games in the US and this is considered the US championships

- It isn't against the rules of the WOB event according to NASGA

- Harrison Bailey III hails from Easton, PA and although wasn't the first to spin basically put it on the map 10 or so years ago at the Celtic and break the World Record.  So the crowd is used to it.  The record reflects a spin throw.

-It is a crowd pleaser in Bethlehem

- There are no foreign athletes competing at the Celtic anymore other than Alistair in the Legends last year.  To me the spin shouldn't be allowed if an overseas thrower is competing at the games because it is distinct disadvantage for them being is spinning is not allowed in Scotland.

I think the IHGF looks into whether a best height listed is a stand or a spin to sort out the rankings for Worlds. I have no personal preference either way.  Both methods are challenging in their own way.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote C. Smith Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 2/23/12 at 12:33am
Sean makes sense. 

I agree with Valenti, but because I think it should be banned everywhere. 

That being said, there is a distinct trend with games no longer allowing the spin, and I suspect more and more will convert (or revert back) to this.  Even those who have spun well in that past (Sean, KO, etc...) have no issue standing for games, so it's probably just a matter of time. 

You could always just ask the AD at Celtic to ban it imo.  Smile 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Silverback Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 2/23/12 at 1:27am
I don't think your right, the guys you mentioned can throw WOB in traditional style, but a lot of the guys spinning big heights could not stand anything significant so they will resist going traditional.  And a lot of those guys are entrenched into games and have connections that will continue to allow this abomination of the sport.  It clearly changes the balance of a game, and it seems to push it to the guys that have the track background.      
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote C. Smith Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 2/23/12 at 3:15am
Let's try to keep this on topic (Spinning at Celtic) for the most part, lest it become the 2012 spin v. stand thread.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Steve Conway Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 2/23/12 at 3:26am
I think Sean answered the question...it's an American Championship, spinning is allowed in the U.S. If I run an International comp., I don't allow the spin. It clearly wouldn't be fair. Here's a question for another thread...many of the "no spin" people spin in the sheaf. That seems hypocritical to me...the sheaf was a standing event originally.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Styler Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 2/23/12 at 3:38am
Hold the phone... We are allowed to stand?!?
Spencer Tyler = Awesome!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Jeff Ingram Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 2/23/12 at 3:49am

I think spinning should be allowed everywhere, but you have to fail a drug test first to qualify.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sean Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 2/23/12 at 4:57am
Originally posted by Steve Conway Steve Conway wrote:

I think Sean answered the question...it's an American Championship, spinning is allowed in the U.S. If I run an International comp., I don't allow the spin. It clearly wouldn't be fair. Here's a question for another thread...many of the "no spin" people spin in the sheaf. That seems hypocritical to me...the sheaf was a standing event originally.
 
Good deal, Steve.
 
As for the sheaf...it's a non-traditional event anyway. Not much fight in that dog.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ken crum Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 2/23/12 at 5:11am
I think you answered your own question......there's no sanctioning body...so....
crum
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CHAD Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 2/23/12 at 5:18am
Pro vs. Am. 

Lightweights.

Masters.

Women

Boom.

Now this thread has everything.
...Josh
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Soul Eater Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 2/23/12 at 5:21am
Seeing as how I will never throw at Celtic this really doesn't pertain to me but many things don't on this board. However when the rules were re-written it clearly states that you may use any style to throw as long as it is deemed safe.

ossing the Weight for Height
Standard Weight:Men
Women
Master
56 lbs.
28 lbs.
42 lbs. or 56 lbs.
The weight will be thrown with one hand only. The weight shall be made of metal but can be of various shapes and sizes including spherical, bullet or box shaped. The handle can either be attached directly to the weight or attached with a length chain. The handle may also be of various shapes and thickness such as a ring, triangle or a "D" shape. The total weight of each implement shall be 28 lb., 42 lbs. and 56 lbs. The women shall throw a 28 lb. weight and the men shall throw a 56 lb. weight. If there is a master's class they may throw a 42 lb. weight instead of a 56 lb. weight. The implement shall not measure more than 18" in overall length but a weight shorter than this is normally used when thrown for height to avoid hitting the ground when swung between the legs. Any throwing style may be used as long as the rules are followed and the style is deemed safe by the judge.

Craig Smith told us in the parking lot in Springfield for the 2003 MWC to shut up and quit whinning about the sheaf your throwing it. Even though they knew we didn't contest it on the west coast at the time. It's just how it works, can't have your way all the time. 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote C. Smith Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 2/23/12 at 5:24am
Originally posted by CHAD CHAD wrote:

Pro vs. Am. 

Lightweights.

Masters.

Women

Boom.

Now this thread has everything.


You forgot drugs.


True story by Kel. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote CHAD Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 2/23/12 at 5:25am
Ingram covered drugs.   Ahem.
...Josh
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote C. Smith Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 2/23/12 at 5:32am
Dammit.

Carry on.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Steve Conway Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 2/23/12 at 7:10am
and Valenti is bearlicious...ding!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Jeff Ingram Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 2/23/12 at 7:39am
Quote It's just how it works, can't have your way all the time. 
 
I'm going to get this put on a big sign for our Games here. When people ask me questions I can just point to it.
God, what a time saver it'll be!
Maybe I can get one for home too.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Soul Eater Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 2/23/12 at 8:02am
I hate to say this and it won't be popular but when it comes to money, don't bringa knife to a gun fight. Unless the gun is not drawn and you are less than 21" away from the gun. You will be dead to rights.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Borges Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 2/23/12 at 12:56pm
Originally posted by Soul Eater Soul Eater wrote:

Seeing as how I will never throw at Celtic this really doesn't pertain to me but many things don't on this board. However when the rules were re-written it clearly states that you may use any style to throw as long as it is deemed safe.

ossing the Weight for Height
Standard Weight:Men
Women
Master
56 lbs.
28 lbs.
42 lbs. or 56 lbs.
The weight will be thrown with one hand only. The weight shall be made of metal but can be of various shapes and sizes including spherical, bullet or box shaped. The handle can either be attached directly to the weight or attached with a length chain. The handle may also be of various shapes and thickness such as a ring, triangle or a "D" shape. The total weight of each implement shall be 28 lb., 42 lbs. and 56 lbs. The women shall throw a 28 lb. weight and the men shall throw a 56 lb. weight. If there is a master's class they may throw a 42 lb. weight instead of a 56 lb. weight. The implement shall not measure more than 18" in overall length but a weight shorter than this is normally used when thrown for height to avoid hitting the ground when swung between the legs. Any throwing style may be used as long as the rules are followed and the style is deemed safe by the judge.

Craig Smith told us in the parking lot in Springfield for the 2003 MWC to shut up and quit whinning about the sheaf your throwing it. Even though they knew we didn't contest it on the west coast at the time. It's just how it works, can't have your way all the time. 


Those are the SHA rules but you have to remember there are multiple rule sets out there and different games use different rule sets. I would specifically note that the IHGA rules are identical to the SHA rules except for one thing, the spin is banned in the IHGA rules. Monterey began using the IHGA rules last year and will continue to do so.
Cheers,

Carlos



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Soul Eater Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 2/23/12 at 2:26pm
I pulled these rules off of nasga not SHA. SHA most likely uses the rules you re=wrote.  Pleasanton uses the IHGF Rules when IHGF is present at our games. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JWC III Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 2/23/12 at 2:56pm

Since we are all rehashing everything we keep saying over and over...

I think the standing WOB and Spinning WOB should be two different events, like open stone and Braemar. 
 
There....I said it...again.
Thom Van Vleck
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dl_buffy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 2/24/12 at 1:39am
Oooo...I like Thom's idea...yep.  (Ooops, did I just weight into a long standing controversy?)
 
:D
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