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North/South 2014

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phatmiked View Drop Down
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    Posted: 12/17/13 at 4:57pm
I just saw a post on the FB about the North Team. Even had to talk a little smack in defense of my southern brothers.

Who's on Team South? Time to step up fellas. There is a fine legacy of trash talk to carry forth.

Duncan? I figured we see three or four vids from you by meow
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Duncan McCallum Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/17/13 at 5:36pm
Because I'm not on Team South.
The man in the arena.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ryan Stewart Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/17/13 at 5:51pm
Tell me we have more sweet Highland games politics going on.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jsully Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/17/13 at 5:59pm
Didn't Shane Sutherland win the South Captain spot? From what I undestand he chose a bunch of his buddies to be on the team. shrug.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KTDupuis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/17/13 at 6:24pm
Cut my post ftom the Ssaaa forum.

For the 17th time, the North vs. South Challenge will be one of the highlights of the SSAAA games calendar. The competition will be held at the Central FL Games in January 2014.
http://www.flascot.com/

For the first time, each team with consist of throwers from both the North and South of the United States, and also from the Highlands and Lowlands of Scotland. Below is the current list for Captains and team members. More to come!!!

North Team
Nick Kahanic - Captain
Chuck Kasson
Jeff Kaste
Matt Hand
<un-named Scottish Thrower>
<un-named Scottish Thrower>

South Team
Shane Sutherland – Captain
Isaac Burchett
Travis Gardner
Kevin Becker
<un-named Scottish Thrower>
<un-named Scottish Thrower>

Best of luck to both teams!!
"I have a right to my opinion, and my opinion is that you have no right to your opinion" - G. Carlin
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KTDupuis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/17/13 at 6:26pm
The guys from Scotland may have been chosen by this point...but I have not been told who they are.
"I have a right to my opinion, and my opinion is that you have no right to your opinion" - G. Carlin
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote phatmiked Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/17/13 at 6:34pm
I was just coming back to note that I should probably have held off on the Judge Judy gif until I had more information.

With that said, the North/South/USA/Scotland concept is kinda cool.  Do the guys from Scotland know its not a straight up USA/Scotland deal?


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote phatmiked Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/17/13 at 6:40pm
Okay . . . . Team South . . .




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TheJeff696 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/17/13 at 6:52pm
I think either way it's going to be a good competition. You never know how it's going to go the day of. 
Jeff Kaste



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sutherland Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/17/13 at 8:05pm
Yeah all my buddies! We hang every weekend. Or I picked 3 guys who will kick my ass and I didn't pick guys you wanted me too. If you need an explanation as to why I didn't pick you or your friend call me. Please bash me all you want but my team 100% deserve to be there and will prove it.

Politics? is this an All star game? Or a team competition? Every member is on the team for a reason. except me?


As for trash talk I think your doubts all but covers it.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sutherland Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/17/13 at 8:11pm
I might also add for all those who think my role is easy. I'm sure I've lost some friends over this decision. So yeah buddies!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jsully Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/17/13 at 8:49pm
Lmao. Somebody's panties are in a bunch.

If you feel you made the right choices you shouldn't have to get all defensive about them.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nathan Parker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/17/13 at 9:12pm
Originally posted by TheJeff696 TheJeff696 wrote:

I think either way it's going to be a good competition. You never know how it's going to go the day of. 
 
I hear they're adding a volleyball toss.  Should separate you from the competition.
 
Oh no he di'int!
 
I kid.  Good luck!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote feefiefofeather Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/17/13 at 9:37pm
I always thought the choices were made based on ranking? That's the way I believe it's been done in the past. That's the way the ladies have done it for East-West, barring any work/travel/finance conflicts.

Team North is gonna be tough to beat, that's for sure!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KTDupuis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/18/13 at 5:59am
It is up to each captain on how to pick the team. It is not a rankings based selection process and never was.
"I have a right to my opinion, and my opinion is that you have no right to your opinion" - G. Carlin
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote C. Smith Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/18/13 at 7:25am
While I suppose that's technically true, it's a bit disingenuous to say that Kevin.   

Since the beginning, it's always been the top ranked guys taking the team spots.  Just look at your history page and note all the names the went on to throw Pro.  So historically, yes, it is an All Star game.     

Let's look at the last years teams listed on the SSAAA site for comparison.  The 2012 teams:

The North had the #5, #8, #9, #10, and #12 ranked Ams from 2011.
The South had the #2, #3, #4, #13, and #19 ranked Ams from 2011. 

Seems to me like the top ranked guys were chosen and if some were unavailable they just went down the list, no?

Now let's look at the 2014 teams:

The North has the #1, #5, #7, and #16 ranked Ams from 2013.
The South has the #2, #21, #159, and #217 ranked Ams from 2013.

I haven't been on a N/S team in over a decade, so I have no dog in this fight, but some might be interested in that information. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jsully Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/18/13 at 7:43am
Originally posted by Nathan Parker Nathan Parker wrote:

I hear they're adding a volleyball toss.  Should separate you from the competition.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KTDupuis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/18/13 at 7:55am

Craig,

 

You are right. My claim that it is not rankings based is not always true. Frankly, the captains chosen can pick the teams however they feel is right. If that person's method is to go based off of rankings and go down the list, that is their choice.

 

However, the game is not a purely ranking based invitation process, where people are given automatic qualification based off of a ranking. That is true, and always has been.

 

For each example where it appears that rankings were used primarily for picking teams, I can probably provide an example of where it obviously wasn't. (Including 2014 for BOTH teams).

"I have a right to my opinion, and my opinion is that you have no right to your opinion" - G. Carlin
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TheJeff696 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/18/13 at 8:01am
Originally posted by jsully jsully wrote:

Originally posted by Nathan Parker Nathan Parker wrote:

I hear they're adding a volleyball toss.  Should separate you from the competition.
 

HA HA HA


I wish I only separated my shoulder. Would have actually healed without surgery. Stupid glenoid labrums. 

If volleyball toss was an event I could just shot put it. Dicks. 
Jeff Kaste



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote adambrezina Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/18/13 at 8:02am
Skinny guy trying to get big
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KTDupuis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/18/13 at 8:08am

Really, I also don't have a dog in this fight. I am just the guy who posts the roster on the SSAAA board.

I will say the rankings can be very misleading. The resepctive rankings of #159, and #217 are in large part becase Kevin Becker had not thrown a breamar stone, and Travis had not thrown breamar stone or light hammer.
 
Even given moderate to average scores in these events (had they been at a game where thee events were contested), I would expect Kevin to move up 600+ points and Travis to move up about 1300+ points. Ranking them somewhere in the 50's and 20's respectively. (for whatever that is worth).
 
For many team captains, when selecting a team they care more about seeing and competing with the other guys than what the DB says about them.
 
 
"I have a right to my opinion, and my opinion is that you have no right to your opinion" - G. Carlin
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote C. Smith Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/18/13 at 8:15am
Originally posted by KTDupuis KTDupuis wrote:

 

For each example where it appears that rankings were used primarily for picking teams, I can probably provide an example of where it obviously wasn't. (Including 2014 for BOTH teams).



I think that's pretty clear, as you state, for both teams for the 2014 year. 

I actually have no problem with the captain of either team picking whoever they want.  It's when it's disguised and touted as the best team available, then that is shitty and patronizing to the guys who are ranked higher and throw farther.

I think people would respect someone saying, "I'm the captain, I picked my friends/guys I want to have fun with/etc... and winning the game isn't that important to me" so much more than trying to explain why they deserve or don't deserve to be there.  The latter just makes it worse imo. 

It's a similar discussion we've had for Pro invites many times regarding the transparency of who deserves to be at a game.   

And I did see that they were missing events, which would obv move them up some.  In my opinion, that just makes a stronger case for the guys who actually travel around and compete as opposed to those that don't and that's why they don't have a full set of scores. 

Anyway, good luck to those involved.  The N/S games are still some of best experiences I've ever had in my throwing career. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KTDupuis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/18/13 at 8:22am
Originally posted by jsully jsully wrote:

Lmao. Somebody's panties are in a bunch.

If you feel you made the right choices you shouldn't have to get all defensive about them.
So let me get this straight...you and Dickens start off by calling Shane out on his choices, and then you give him crap for getting defensive about those choices. Ah, good times indeed.
 
Frankly. he handled it way better than I would have. He offered to discuss it with people who wanted to know his selection process reasons. I would have just told you to stuff it (or some other variant of that).
 
Anyone else who things they were overlooked for team selection, feel free to attend the SSAAA championship in June. (Blairsville, GA). If you win, you are SSAAA Champion and are assured a spot on the team. Usually you will also asked to be captain, and then you can chose your team as you see fit. Simple as that.
"I have a right to my opinion, and my opinion is that you have no right to your opinion" - G. Carlin
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sean Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/18/13 at 8:22am
I think for pro games they should invite everyone and then send home the guys they don't like.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jsully Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/18/13 at 8:36am
Originally posted by KTDupuis KTDupuis wrote:

So let me get this straight...you and Dickens start off by calling Shane out on his choices, and then you give him crap for getting defensive about those choices. Ah, good times indeed.
 
Frankly. he handled it way better than I would have. He offered to discuss it with people who wanted to know his selection process reasons. I would have just told you to stuff it (or some other variant of that).
 
 
I relayed information that I had heard. There was a big can of stale air among some of the South Ams and nobody seemed to want to address it. I really think they just wanted to know his selection process as well, which he as offered and I think that is respectable.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote phatmiked Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/18/13 at 9:40am
So, I've said this before . . . I'm kind of a big fan of the HG.  I think the team comps are especially cool and am proud to have been included in the N/S and E/W competitions.

The N/S comp was completely off my radar.  I am old.  My mind is getting weak.  I hadn't thought about it for a while until I saw a reference to it on the FB.  I got excited and wanted to know what was happening this year.  The post listed the North Team.  I was very curious about the South Team, the throwers who would be representing the South, and those who apparently will not, and who I will be rooting for.

I don't think its reasonable to have a North vs South team competition and not have people be interested and get invested in it.  And, I don't think anyone should be surprised if someone is puzzled by the selections when all that is known about a couple of them is that they are waaaay down the board.  The points made above illustrate this.  I am aware that the process is pretty much arbitrary and up to the coach.  But, again, this is a high profile competition.  People are interested.

If it is problematic that people take interest in the competition and who is selected for the team, maybe it shouldn't be called the North vs South Team competition.  Maybe something like "a bunch of random guys" team competition.

With that said, Imma root for the South Team.  Shane says he selected the team that he thinks will win.  So be it.  I hope they all step up.  I really don't like any of those dicks on the North team (Wink  Wink  this is good natured ribbing, lest anyone be confused and get their feelings hurt).

I think I've blathered on more than enough. 

Go Team South!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sutherland Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/18/13 at 9:56am
From the desk of Robert E. Lee

You made a good choice, we lost the ranking board competition, but seeing how it counts for Jack, we still have a chance.

When the invasion comes we will be ready.

I hope everyone north of the Mason Dixon line see us as the underdog too.

Good luck General Grant.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nathan Parker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/18/13 at 10:03am
Originally posted by KTDupuis KTDupuis wrote:

Originally posted by jsully jsully wrote:

Lmao. Somebody's panties are in a bunch.

If you feel you made the right choices you shouldn't have to get all defensive about them.
So let me get this straight...you and Dickens start off by calling Shane out on his choices, and then you give him crap for getting defensive about those choices. Ah, good times indeed.
 
Frankly. he handled it way better than I would have. He offered to discuss it with people who wanted to know his selection process reasons. I would have just told you to stuff it (or some other variant of that).
 
Anyone else who things they were overlooked for team selection, feel free to attend the SSAAA championship in June. (Blairsville, GA). If you win, you are SSAAA Champion and are assured a spot on the team. Usually you will also asked to be captain, and then you can chose your team as you see fit. Simple as that.
 
 
Kevin,  I was under the impression that whoever won Blairsville would be the captain of the South team.  Is that correct?  Or maybe a South guy keeps winning it? If so, how does one become the North captain.  If us Eskimos know in advance then I know a few of us might work on doing what we need to do.  Thanks!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KTDupuis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/18/13 at 12:02pm
Nathan,
 
The winner of the SSAAA championship is given first condideration for Captain, but it is not a given. Almost all of the time that is what happens, and it would take extreme circumstances for it to not happen.
 
The only example I have is one year the winner was Mike Derrick. He was invited to be on the team, but was not chosen as captain. The reason I was told was that he was crazy busy with his business, and he wasn't sure he could make the N/S game at all. (Eventually, he wasn't able to make the game).
 
The North Captain is typically chosen by KC and Susan Cummings. They tend to ask someone they know and have seen compete in the past (at their games preferably).
 
"I have a right to my opinion, and my opinion is that you have no right to your opinion" - G. Carlin
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