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C. Smith View Drop Down
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    Posted: 9/22/14 at 9:19am
Someone asked me the following, and I was unsure of the answer (or rather the SMAI answer):

Is the MWC's age qualification just like Weightlifting (and other masters sports), where the cut off is year of birth, as opposed to the actual day?  I assume it is, because that makes the most sense (obv), but figured I'd ask the man to be sure. 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Larry Ventress Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 9/22/14 at 10:10am
It is your birthday vs the opening day of the competition.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote C. Smith Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 9/22/14 at 10:16am
So it's actual date, as opposed to year? 

So two people with a birthday two days apart...one could be eligible and one could be ineligible?

That seems quite silly, and exactly why other sports don't do it that way. 




IWF - Masters Weightlifting:

Quote A weightlifter can enter the Masters programme on the 1st January in the year he
or she becomes 35 years of age regardless of the fact that the birth date may be as
late as the 31st December.


National Senior Games (Masters T&F):

Quote AGE FOR COMPETITION AT THE 2015 NATIONAL SENIOR GAMES
Age division for all singles competition at the 2015 National Senior Games will be determined by the athlete’s age as of December 31, 2015.


^^ That makes sense.


Edited by C. Smith - 9/22/14 at 12:02pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote brandell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 9/22/14 at 10:36am
Originally posted by C. Smith C. Smith wrote:


IWF - Masters Weightlifting:

Quote A weightlifter can enter the Masters programme on the 1st January in the year he
or she becomes 35 years of age regardless of the fact that the birth date may be as
late as the 31st December.

^^ That makes sense.

So if said athlete has a Birthday late December they should be allowed to compete nearly a year early?
 
And what if said lifter competes, wins the championship then retires or dies before they were really that age?? They were never really a master correct?  Yeah I know...I know... But just sayin.  

BTW in 2013 at the MWC one of the greatest ever in Gene Flynn was just a few days from crossing over into the new age group and may have broken that age groups records at that comp. Should he have just been allowed to break them although he wasn't that age yet by a few days?  

I agree with the rule you must actually be 40+ when the competition happens to compete. But then again I am looking for any rule that can get anyone with the last name "Miller" out of my age division...

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Detroitpete Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 9/22/14 at 10:51am
It's your birth DAY.  You are either at least 40 years old (some games like Alma--45) on the day of the event, or you aren't.  Sort of like weight class ;-)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote C. Smith Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 9/22/14 at 11:05am
Originally posted by brandell brandell wrote:

So if said athlete has a Birthday late December they should be allowed to compete nearly a year early?


Based on the precedent that has been set in other sports, yes.  Of course the game would have to take place in January for that to occur....lol. 
 

Originally posted by brandell brandell wrote:

BTW in 2013 at the MWC one of the greatest ever in Gene Flynn was just a few days from crossing over into the new age group and may have broken that age groups records at that comp. Should he have just been allowed to break them although he wasn't that age yet by a few days? 


According to other sports, yes. 


And you reference the 'rule' that states it's not the case for the SMAI, can you go ahead and cite that rule for me?



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote C. Smith Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 9/22/14 at 11:07am
Originally posted by brandell brandell wrote:

I agree with the rule you must actually be 40+ when the competition happens to compete. But then again I am looking for any rule that can get anyone with the last name "Miller" out of my age division...


Originally posted by Detroitpete Detroitpete wrote:

It's your birth DAY.  You are either at least 40 years old (some games like Alma--45) on the day of the event, or you aren't.  Sort of like weight class ;-)



Interesting, but I suppose I shouldn't be surprised that people in these classes feel this way. 

And yes, I'm kidding....





...kinda.  Big smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Detroitpete Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 9/22/14 at 11:09am
Craig--why would you think anyone in these classes would give a shit about your opinion? I kid.  I kid because I love.  Sort of.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote C. Smith Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 9/22/14 at 11:11am
I'm merely asking a question to the SMAI, I haven't given my opinion, have I?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Detroitpete Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 9/22/14 at 11:13am
"Interesting, but I suppose I shouldn't be surprised that people in these classes feel this way.

And yes, I'm kidding...."
Its either an opinion or a statement of fact.  Either way...whatever, man :)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Detroitpete Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 9/22/14 at 11:14am
And here's where I cease feeding the troll on this.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dWood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 9/22/14 at 11:15am
At Springfield MWC was 39 yrs 11 1/2 months. Couldn't throw but it was all good. Had a good time shagging/catching up with friends,etc
JUST BRING IT /

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote C. Smith Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 9/22/14 at 11:15am
Oh that Mark, lol. 

Yea, that's my opinion.  I thought you meant regarding what the post was actually about. 

I would hope that people who are close, like Gene was in 2013 (I didn't know that occurred), would be able to compete without people whining about it, especially since there's a precedent in other sports, but....

I'm not even trollin', I just thought it was a legit question for Kevin.  I've seen 4 people answer the question in this thread, and no one cited or linked the actual rule.  the only thing on the SMAI site is just a blurb in the 'about' page.  Is it just a verbal thing/common knowledge thing?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote brandell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 9/22/14 at 11:33am
Originally posted by C. Smith C. Smith wrote:

Oh that Mark, lol. 

Yea, that's my opinion.  I thought you meant regarding what the post was actually about. 

I would hope that people who are close, like Gene was in 2013 (I didn't know that occurred), would be able to compete without people whining about it, especially since there's a precedent in other sports, but....

I'm not even trollin', I just thought it was a legit question for Kevin.  I've seen 4 people answer the question in this thread, and no one cited or linked the actual rule.  the only thing on the SMAI site is just a blurb in the 'about' page.  Is it just a verbal thing/common knowledge thing?

I would think "The MWC competition is open to all athletes over 40 year of age with proper qualification as determined by the SMAI."   Would be clear imho. Not TURNING 40 that year, but already 40 in order to compete in the WMC.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nathan Parker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 9/22/14 at 11:39am
Spring Break 2001 would've been a whole lot funner if drinking age was "year of" rather than actual birthdate Wink
 
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote agm_ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 9/22/14 at 12:07pm
Quote
Is the MWC's age qualification just like Weightlifting (and other masters sports), where the cut off is year of birth, as opposed to the actual day? I assume it is, because that makes the most sense (obv), but figured I'd ask the man to be sure.


Quote
So two people with a birthday two days apart...one could be eligible and one could be ineligible?

That seems quite silly, and exactly why other sports don't do it that way.


Originally posted by C. Smith C. Smith wrote:

I'm merely asking a question to the SMAI, I haven't given my opinion, have I?


Yes, I do believe you have.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote C. Smith Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 9/22/14 at 12:15pm
The first statement seems more like fact, no?  Although I suppose there could be another reason those organizations are doing that...

And the second is me stating that people born two days apart may not be able to compete against each other is silly.  It is.  If you want to extrapolate that to whether or not I think it should be yearly for the SMAI, so be it.

Honestly I don't have a dog in the fight, and it was merely a question posed to me.  I wonder if it's been discussed before?  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote agm_ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 9/22/14 at 12:52pm
You laid out two options, said that one obviously made the most sense, and the other was silly. Yeah, that's an opinion, in my opinion. Not that there's anything wrong with having one.

As far as previous discussions go, I don't think there have been any on this board. Face-to-face, in email, or elsewhere, I have no idea? I do remember the second time the MWC was in Inverness, Jason Young qualified by a day, and won his class.

As for other organizations, here's the rule for World Masters Athletics for their world championships:

Quote
Rule 141     Age Groups
141.1 An athlete’s age group shall be determined by his date of birth. Throughout any Championships, an athlete shall compete in the age group for which he qualifies on the first competition day for those Championships and in no other age group except as allowed by specific team and relay rules.


And here's the USATF rule for all events:

Quote
4. The age of a competitor on the first day of the meet determines the competitor's division for individual events.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote C. Smith Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 9/22/14 at 1:06pm
Interesting.  I would have assumed USATF would be in line with IWF and National Seniors Games. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote phatmiked Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 9/22/14 at 1:22pm
Craig just hates old people.  So do I.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sean Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 9/22/14 at 2:00pm
Old people are the worst.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Borges Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 9/22/14 at 2:43pm
Originally posted by Sean Sean wrote:

Old people are the worst.
Not true, old light people are worser.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Trainerterry Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 9/23/14 at 9:10am
a good reason for a cutoff date would be based on time of year the event is scheduled. unlike most sports the MWC is not at the same time each year. Some years it is in spring, others in fall etc. A person in theory could compete 6 times in an age class or only 4 times in an other based on this.

So a good question
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jhbucy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 9/23/14 at 3:56pm
Originally posted by Borges Borges wrote:

Originally posted by Sean Sean wrote:

Old people are the worst.
Not true, old light people are worser.
Old, light, short people are the worstest. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Soul Eater Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 9/25/14 at 11:10am
Craig your funny, I thought the answer to your question was obvious. And origanlly I don't think it was calculated but I wasn't incharge. But I think they just went with what was already in place in the established 50 class. Which was you turned 50 you were ok to throw in the 50 class. Very Scottish, very simple. Lots of folks didn't think the 50's belonged. Now you got names like Alistair Gunn throwing, people want to know the results. Changing it at this point, would be more of a hassle and fight than anyone of us needs or wants to deal with at this point. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote greynolds177 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 9/26/14 at 3:12am
I love this post. 
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