o.k., whats your best STANDING 56# WOB.  I am interested to know your best lift vs lifetime pull in WOB:

List your best ever Deadlift:

Best Power Clean:

Best Snatch:

and Finally Best ever STANDING WOB pull:

Lets see how it shakes out.

Goin fishing tomorrow.........

List your best ever Deadlift: 465lbs (18 months ago, real max would probably be about 550lbs, never do them)

Best Power Clean: 352lbs

Best Power Snatch: 242lbs

and Finally Best ever STANDING WOB pull: 13 feet (done when Clean was 325lbs and snatch 238lbs)

Kearney is right. I remember those discussions.

I can respect people that like dead-lifts. You do what you love. I never did a single deadlift. I never saw much use for it with the heavy events. When your training time is limited there's other more useful things to do.

But hey if you love it then rip it!

I'm curious about this as well so I'll help by adding in my marks with hopes of continuing this thread.

Best ever Deadlift: 462

Best Power Clean: 260

Best Snatch: 185

Best ever STANDING WOB pull: 12'6"

All right here we go – Part II of last year’s discussion about certain lifts now applied to the success of a certain event. Very creative Roy, whish I thought of this last year. This will be interesting if there is any kind of correlation.

I’ll play:

My best WOB standing was this year at 16’ but I think on that day I could have gone 16’ 6” if I hadn’t had Mike P. cranking it 17’6”. By the way I did have my shirt on.

My best Clean at that time was like 140K for 6 reps (I don’t do singles – lowest rep count is 3’s continuous)

Best lifetime  – like it matters is 165k – that’s all I needed in 1995

Don’t wide grip snatch but have close griped with hands together - 110k for 3’s in 1995

Deadlifts – is that when you pick up something dead and bury it?

All lifts are from a raised platform where the weights are pulled from bellow your feet with out stopping between reps.

Roy, do you ever rip lips with a fly rod? Heard John Walker hits them pretty hard these days.

Haven't used the fly rod yet......but a good friend of mine does.  I'll have to indulge next year on that one.

Steve D wrote: Deadlifts – is that when you pick up something dead and bury it?

Very, and I mean Very well said....

big MAC wrote: List your best ever Deadlift: 465lbs (18 months ago, real max would probably be about 550lbs, never do them) Best Power Clean: 352lbs Best Power Snatch: 242lbs and Finally Best ever STANDING WOB pull: 13 feet (done when Clean was 325lbs and snatch 238lbs)

Learn the double knee bend and you are over 16' in 3 comps or less.  Paul Ferency is THE legend of this technique.

Paul, send him the video.........

List your best ever Deadlift: 685lbs. -full raw DL

Best Power Clean: 365lbs.

Best Snatch: 245lbs. close grip, 260lbs. clean grip

and Finally Best ever STANDING WOB pull: 17'-6"-cranking for 18'

Roy Bogue wrote: big MAC wrote: List your best ever Deadlift: 465lbs (18 months ago, real max would probably be about 550lbs, never do them) Best Power Clean: 352lbs Best Power Snatch: 242lbs and Finally Best ever STANDING WOB pull: 13 feet (done when Clean was 325lbs and snatch 238lbs) Learn the double knee bend and you are over 16' in 3 comps or less.  Paul Ferency is THE legend of this technique. Paul, send him the video.........

Found it on Ryans site, the 17'7. Thanks for the vote of confidence. I'll likey be doing a WOB in 2 weeks, we'll see what happens.

Best deadlift: 775 (1991)

Best Power Clean: 405  (1991)

Best Power Snatch: 295 (1991)

Best WOB with 56#: 12'   (2005)

I've done snatches twice since 1991 and haven't deadlifted since 2000. So now they would be pitiful.

Last year I did power cleans in only 5 workouts. My best efort was 315 for 2.

WOB 13'

DL 495

snatch and clean I dont do them whereas, I wasn't properly trained in the art of them. I ask KP but he decline to show me. Oh well, I will just get by on the field with my good looks and humor

Dead- 655 raw in competition @252lbs (Adel, GA 1999),Clean- 320 (2000), Hang Clean -300 (2005),Power Snatch-220 (When needed, if ever), Best WOB 15ft @ 220lbs

Best WOB performances (and most other events) are always after a week of CG Hang Snatches with 65-85lbs for sets of 5 and some bounding/jumps and NOTHING else. 

Improving technique is the only thing that ever really made a difference in the WOB or other events for me.  I started the games in 2000 and only compete in 5-8 each year.  I have gotten weaker and lighter every year  and have only seen improvements because of attention to technique (which is still not too good). I, and many others I think, would rather be ridiculously strong and throw well.  But, it has never worked.  The more I lift, the slower I move and recover.  IMO durability and the ability to recover makes the better athlete in the end.  That's why I throw best after almost no training (no durabilty or recovery ability). 

dl 505

clean225

snatch165

wob11.6

5.9 187

5'6" 200lbs.

Best DL - 450 (when I was young and stupid)  within the past year like 410.

Clean - 190

Snatch - 145

WOB - 11ft, but I hit the bar @ 12 and I think I should get to throw from on top of a box or something.

Pure strength is fine. Pure speed is fine. However, one without the other only gets you so far. I'm trying to increase both as much as possible. Also I'm not forgeting technique. That's what helps you exploit both.  

Dead: 7ish

Clean: n/a

Snatch: n/a

Standing WOB: 16'9"

Myles?

735, 16'9"

Snatch and clean, ha ha ha ha ha

dWood wrote: will embark on dead's and fronts-to get back

Interesting.  Dan brings the front squat into the equation....

C. Smith wrote: dWood wrote: will embark on dead's and fronts-to get back         Interesting.  Dan brings the front squat into the equation....

I was going to list it, but figured it would muddy the waters.  I wanted to compare pulls.

David - if you really cannot deadlift 505 then I will poop right on my own pillow...

best dead: 505 - probably can do more though with 3 training sessions.

best hang clean with straps: 290

best hang snatch: 205

best pull with a full 160 gram Ultimate frisbee disc: roughly 250 feet

best wob: 17'6

15'6 from the stand.

Topic: Deadlift or Olympic lift for (hmmm...)WOB?

...both?

Don't lift much!  Lifted Feb, Mar, and April of this last year.  Focused on rack deadlift from just above kneecap and just below kneecap to help upper end pull strength and speed.

Best Dead pull above kneecap:  805

Best Dead pull just below kneecap: 605 (see the weak area? was at just about 500 when I started)

Best HANG CLEAN  with straps:  315 x 11 reps my very last lifting session in late april.

Best Wt for ht stand this year: 

starting height was always 15

every comp from a stand was clean through 16

best height 17' (new stand pr)

best spin this year was 17'6"

I found a BIG difference improving my mid and top end pull strength in ALL my events.  Hammers went up again finally, wts were good all year, but I turned way more cabers than I ever have also this season. 

A more apt comparison might be wob and vertical jump - that way we can include the talent freaks like the Barron boyz . Don the Stewart says when he front squatted his vertical back up last year - he set a new world record.I came home from Loon w. that info and did fronts and vertical jumps for 2 weeks and got back over 15' for the first time in a year. In 2005 Myles and I had a vertical jump contest all off-season and we both had great wob years - I didn't do it last off season and dropped a foot 'till the front squats this summer..........................wob 15.7 ...vertical 2005 29.5

Dead: 505
Power Clean: 275
WOB: 13'6"

There is less correlation among these lifts than I thought there would be.

The lighter the implement there greater the need for speed and the less emphasis on strength.  An example would be the need for strength for a shot putter vs. a javelin thrower. 

Now don't think strength isn't important because it is.  If moving light weights fast is key then what is a "light weight" is relative.  What's light for me and what's light for Myles is obviously very different so the stronger you are the better but speed is looking to be of greater impact on the WOB with all other things being equal.  So I think Baab's got something with the vert. idea.

Best Dead 600lbs

Best Clean 325lbs

Snatch N/A

WOB (stand) 15'

 Deadlift 3'' off the ground 750x4x4

Stiffleg Deadlift 650x4x10

Powerclean N/A

WOB 16' 6" COMP. 17' 3" TRAINING

Timing, Timing, Timing.

AGE 20 , POWER CLEAN 385 X3 ,  16 LB SHOT -63'10

AGE 40 , POWER CLEAN 365 X1 , 17' 56 FOR HT STANDING .

AGE 47,  DEADLIFT 725 X1, 20'6 42 FR HT STANDING .

SOME STRONG CATS OUT THERE .

I WILL BENCH MORE THAN TERRI JAMES THIS YEAR.  JUST FINISHED MY BENCH WORK OUT, 145 4X6 .  WHICH SHOULD PUT ME AT 52' W/ THE LT STONE.

M-BAAB wrote: Tim - when Myles deaded 600++ in 2005 , he also verticall(ed) right at 28"  at a bodyweight close to 300 - this combo of power and speed /explosiveness equals 16+ wob . Add in 46 years young and you've got a freak.

Agreed on the freak thing.  When you add strength plus speed...that's when things get crazy.

Never have tried for a "max" effort in either deads, snatches or cleans. WOB PR 16' - always though high pulls were really beneficial, being 6' 7" probably helps too....

17/20 wrote: AGE 20 , POWER CLEAN 385 X3 ,  16 LB SHOT -63'10 AGE 40 , POWER CLEAN 365 X1 , 17' 56 FOR HT STANDING . AGE 47,  DEADLIFT 725 X1, 20'6 42 FR HT STANDING . SOME STRONG CATS OUT THERE . I WILL BENCH MORE THAN TERRI JAMES THIS YEAR.  JUST FINISHED MY BENCH WORK OUT, 145 4X6 .  WHICH SHOULD PUT ME AT 52' W/ THE LT STONE.

Thats a freak right there.

david barron wrote: Me am weak. DL 485 Hang Clean 315 Snatch 225 WOB 17'3" I think Steve D's onto something there - it's less about how much weight you can do, more about how fast you can lift it.

Don't worry Dave, I still think you're strong, so does Roy, even though he won't admit it.

550 front in suit and wraps, 257 BW, the 735 was the same BW. 

I am jumping this off season, but I think the key for some of us is the landing.  That is the killer, not the take off.  I think box jumps, up on the box and stairs?  Any other ideas.  All American?

I have cleared 16' in WOB maybe even 16'6"  man If I could learn how to "lift" I think I could go 16'8 1/4" maybe 16'9"  But Spinning is cool too.

Newbie

Hey Roy,

Regardless of the outcome of this thread it won't help your fishing cast you wussssssy boy!!!

As I argued with Sanford last year, it is more about application of power than pure strength.  I don't care how strong you are, the weight won't fly if you cannot apply!!!

Ok, time for somebody really weak to weigh in

Deadlift - 475lbs

Power Clean - 242lbs

Power Snatch - 185lbs

WOB - 10'

hbaileyIII wrote: Hey Roy, Regardless of the outcome of this thread it won't help your fishing cast you wussssssy boy!!! As I argued with Sanford last year, it is more about application of power than pure strength.  I don't care how strong you are, the weight won't fly if you cannot apply!!!

HBIII couldn’t have said it better in that statement.  From what I read on this thread is that 99% are plenty strong to throw these events far...really far.  I believe, from experience that most athletes lack the fundamentals to apply their strengths from the weight room to the events (Like me in the WOB)

With that said, how does one improve in that area?  Well again, from my experience, if an athlete devotes his time and effort to apply both fundamental throwing Drills (Not throwing...I am talking two different things here) and sport specific lifting/core emphasis in their training they will achieve greater success in this sport, rather from just lifting heavy. Though, lifting heavy with static lifts has its place as well, but only in the off-season to build the strength base, for the more important dynamic phase the pre season phase.      

Proper flexibility and torso strength is critical for success in WOB. You have to be able to get your torso upright with your hips under you. Watch a guy front squat and you'll get a good feel for how he will do in the standing WOB. If he can get deep with a near maximal lift and not pitch forward then he is going to do well in conventional WOB using leg strength. Watch Koklyaev doing front squats and you'll see what I mean. I think Matt has nearly perfect standing WOB technique and it is really impressive to see how upright he gets his torso with his hips down REALLY LOW just before he explodes into the weight.

There are a few guys out there who can throw really high using back strength too (that old WSM where Kaz was launching the 56 is a prime example). That requires mountains of strength.

In the interest of science (and boredom) I went ahead and compiled an excel sheet with some graphs of this data. My goal was to get a definitive answer (limited by the relevance of this data), to the question of which lift, DL or Clean, is a better indicator of WOB ability. I decided not to include the Snatch data as the level of technique required for that lift is much higher than for the other lifts. I also omitted the entries of those who did not supply data for all 3 lifts.

First I normalized the data by dividing each lift by dividing each lift by the average, and plotted it in the first graph. My assumption here was that straight, flat lines would indicate a direct correlation between all 3 lifts. In other words, if your DL is twice mine, then so is you clean and so is your WOB. The greater the angles the lines make with each other, the less correlated the lifts are. I made a graph is DL and WOB, and a graph of Clean and WOB in the same fashion.

From eyeballing these graphs it is difficult to tell which lift is more strongly correlated with the WOB. So I used this formula to determine it mathematically:

sum(abs(DL/avgDL-WOB/avgWOB)) = 2.11

sum(abs(Clean/avgClean-WOB/avgWOB)) = 1.68

So I took everyones normalized DL and subtracted their normalized WOB and then added those values up. Then I did the same for the Clean and the WOB. And the fact that the number is lower for the Clean and the WOB I think tells me that the Clean is a better indicator of WOB ability then is the DL, which is what I had assumed in the first place.

If anyone knows anything about math/statistics plz tell me if what I did makes any sense.

http://www36.websamba.com/jonathanbarlow/pulling.xls - http://www36.websamba.com/jonathanbarlow/pulling.xls

I would have to agree with Ryan on this thread. I do believe that you do need a reasonable amount of strength for a competitive standing WOB but it really does come down to how you apply the strength into the movement. I also firmly believe that timing/technique along with the ability to accelerate the weight up and over the bar is the main key to success. The majority of the guys posting on this thread are strong enough to clear 17’ plus but most likely lack the key mentioned above. I have competed against guys my whole life that were incredibly strong but couldn’t apply it to the movement. It is most notable in Field & Track events like the throws. Obviously more at the lower than elite levels where technique is at it’s lowest.

Best DL-405

Best Pc-225

best snatch-185  hit myself in the forehead at 195

wfh-12'  hit the bar at 13'

bodyweight was 198  at 6'

Best hang power-clean 190Kg

Best Hang power-snatch 140kg

Best deadlift 300Kg x 5, 340Kg x 1

Best Standing WOB 17'6"

But I credit an exercise that I started doing around 1995 or so with my WOB success. I do a modified explosive good morning that almost mimic my CRS Wt for Ht pull exactly. I do them fast and heavy, sometimes going to 200Kgs. I'll have to get somebody to video tape what I do and post it so you can see it. It's pretty wild.

david barron wrote: This reminds me of that movie... you know, the one with Booger and Poindexter and Lamarr and that guy Ogre where the're in college and join a fraternity... what's it called, revenge of the something?

...awesome people

Silverback wrote: Steve, why didn't you give us the WOB in meters?  We are in America bro, the only place they deal in Kilos is in Miami.

Somebody please translate for Myles.

Steve P.,

Get that on video, I want to see it. 

I guess I would question wether we are talking hang clean(Knee level) or power clean(floor).  If you look at data from a power clean it is somewhat of a dead lift into a hang clean.  So it might be more interesting to look at the hang vs the dead. 

I have never heard anyone use the word petite when describing MWR!!!

If I remember the "Revenge of the Nerds" movies, don't the Nerds always end up with the hot chicks because of their ingenuity?  Because that's how it is in real life too, isn't it?

Steve D wrote:  Another thought worth mentioning with regards to standing WOB is that emotion, intensity, grit, … is also a component that can be a strong contributor to success.

Yeah Steve, but emotion intensity and grit were tossed out the window when people started spinning.........Ooooh wait, wrong thread.  That outta ruffle some feathers!

Best Ever Deadlift: 735

Best Ever Power Clean: 335

Best Ever Snatch: your sister

Best Ever Standing WOB: 17-6

I got a sister? Damn

Doing a WOB on Saturday in a strongman comp I entered. Hopefully I do better than 13ft...

don't take too wide of a stance. PUSH with the hips before you pull up with the arm.

When you lean down to grab the weight to start swinging, MAKE SURE your throwing arm is as LONG as possible. Actually take your none throwing arm and lengthen the throwing arm (flattening out the shoulder) as much as possible - the key is a loose long shoulder.

also, you should hook grip the weight with a tiny bit of tacky on the thumb. This helps relax the grip, which relaxes the arm and makes it a longer lever.

woohoo - lookit me giving advice in the weight for height. But technique is all I got with a 285 power clean...

Will B. - 15' 6" for life

Hey Roy,

Either pick up a weight and throw or a rod and cast.  Either way, shut your pie hole!!!  Isn't there a sport fishing message board for you to harass people on.

hbaileyIII wrote: Hey Roy, Either pick up a weight and throw or a rod and cast.  Either way, shut your pie hole!!!  Isn't there a sport fishing message board for you to harass people on.

Eat me.

will barron wrote: don't take too wide of a stance. PUSH with the hips before you pull up with the arm. When you lean down to grab the weight to start swinging, MAKE SURE your throwing arm is as LONG as possible. Actually take your none throwing arm and lengthen the throwing arm (flattening out the shoulder) as much as possible - the key is a loose long shoulder. also, you should hook grip the weight with a tiny bit of tacky on the thumb. This helps relax the grip, which relaxes the arm and makes it a longer lever. woohoo - lookit me giving advice in the weight for height. But technique is all I got with a 285 power clean... Will B. - 15' 6" for life

Thanks Will, I was thinking about the hips today, that makes total sense.

dead-low 6's

clean-275

snatch-lots

wob-about 13'

john stop giving away are secrets! LOL just kiding, no but seriously!

Another thread from the past that many will likely find interesting.

Hey Roy,

I wasn't focussing on your banter with your buddies.  There is some good info in this thread, like this:

Ryan Vierra wrote: hbaileyIII wrote: Hey Roy, Regardless of the outcome of this thread it won't help your fishing cast you wussssssy boy!!! As I argued with Sanford last year, it is more about application of power than pure strength.  I don't care how strong you are, the weight won't fly if you cannot apply!!! HBIII couldn’t have said it better in that statement.  From what I read on this thread is that 99% are plenty strong to throw these events far...really far.  I believe, from experience that most athletes lack the fundamentals to apply their strengths from the weight room to the events (Like me in the WOB) With that said, how does one improve in that area?  Well again, from my experience, if an athlete devotes his time and effort to apply both fundamental throwing Drills (Not throwing...I am talking two different things here) and sport specific lifting/core emphasis in their training they will achieve greater success in this sport, rather from just lifting heavy. Though, lifting heavy with static lifts has its place as well, but only in the off-season to build the strength base, for the more important dynamic phase the pre season phase.

and this:

Steve D wrote: I would have to agree with Ryan on this thread. I do believe that you do need a reasonable amount of strength for a competitive standing WOB but it really does come down to how you apply the strength into the movement. I also firmly believe that timing/technique along with the ability to accelerate the weight up and over the bar is the main key to success. The majority of the guys posting on this thread are strong enough to clear 17’ plus but most likely lack the key mentioned above. I have competed against guys my whole life that were incredibly strong but couldn’t apply it to the movement. It is most notable in Field & Track events like the throws. Obviously more at the lower than elite levels where technique is at it’s lowest. Another thought worth mentioning with regards to standing WOB is that emotion, intensity, grit, … is also a component that can be a strong contributor to success.

WOW!! My first post ever was on this. I have alot differnt numbers a year later.

rack pull above the knee- 830

deadlift- 625

clean-305

WOB- 16' in practice, 15'6 in games.

cant wait to check back next year.

At callander games in 2004 i was talking between events with wout zilstra and according to him front squats worked best for his wfh.

Also matt sandford used to do single high pulls in a modified cable pulley machine from elevated boxes.