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Can different hammer handles effect you?

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Forum Name: Training
Forum Discription: This forum is for discussion about training for the Scottish Heavy Events.
URL: http://www.nasgaweb.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=826
Printed Date: 3/26/26 at 9:49pm
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Topic: Can different hammer handles effect you?
Posted By: JISurfer
Subject: Can different hammer handles effect you?
Date Posted: 4/25/05 at 10:55am
This is probably me just trying to make myself feel better about sucking in the hammer right now, but do hammer handles effect your style at all?

Here's my reasoning. Last year, all I ever threw with(in practice) were hammer handles made out of conduit PVC. This year, I've been throwing with the way more flexible regular PVC. I noticed today, that when I held the hammer straight out from my body, the head was bending waaaaaaaaay down, almost to the ground. Sure, with the conduit, there's a nice bit of flexibility, but not that much.

To me, it seems that if you were used to the stronger/stiffer handle, your timing would be off with the more flexible one, ie the regular PVC, due to the more flexible handle bending farther back. In turn, this would effect the amount of force you could use in your explosion, thus making you slow down your winds to catch up with the head. Overall, this would make you slower and less explosive, causing you to get in the habit or being slower on your winds and delivery.

Also, the exagerated bending would seem to throw you off your balance, thus making you change your whole base to compensate for the late arriving head. Since I have changed my base, it's a bit harder for me to block at the end as well.

To me, this all makes sense, but does this sound viable or not? Any input would be greatly appreciated.



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eh...



Replies:
Posted By: Roy Bogue
Date Posted: 4/25/05 at 11:06am

Oh My God!!

Oh My God!

Oh My God!

Chill BITCH!

Your making us other panicy Hammer Throwers all friggin neurotic......Must let go of mind screw must let go!!!!!!

My hammer Sucketh as well.

 



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Donate lately?


Posted By: JISurfer
Date Posted: 4/25/05 at 11:11am

Hahaha! 

Maybe I'm just over thinking it.  Just a tad though.



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eh...


Posted By: Wayne Hill
Date Posted: 4/25/05 at 12:42pm
Well, all that you said seems to make sense, but I have my doubts.  My own hammers have rattan handles, which a lot of people like.  They're stiff and light and give a pretty good grip.  Then again, I found that throwing Dr. Bill's 16 with a 1/2" conduit handle felt really nice.  Then again again, I suspect using the smaller handle on a 22 would be just awful.

In other words, yes, I think you're overthinking it (just like the rest of us whose hammers sucketh).

-Wayne


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"We may be small, but we're slow." - MIT Rugby


Posted By: JISurfer
Date Posted: 4/25/05 at 12:45pm
Yeah, y'all are probably right.  It just seems ALMOST logical when I thought about my hips and how I use them, ie like in a hula hoop.

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eh...


Posted By: Jason Pauli
Date Posted: 4/25/05 at 2:37pm

I always threw better with whippy handles.  I think that your technique modifies itself timing-wise to whatever you're practicing with.  I used PVC the last few years and when I got a hold of a stiff handle the way I moved changed.

It always seemd to me the best hammer throwers did better with stiff handles.  I forget what he threw but Ryan launched that Fair Hill heavy hammer with the shovel handle on it years ago.  Maybe the stiffer it is the less energy is lost.

Whoa... physics dude.

~Jason



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Team Pauli - You never walk alone


Posted By: JISurfer
Date Posted: 4/25/05 at 11:41pm
Physics indeed!  My brain hurts more now, than all four years of college.  Ofcourse, I got my BS in Criminal Justice(your bad, then be punished), not Physics.

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eh...


Posted By: Wayne Hill
Date Posted: 4/26/05 at 1:36am
Originally posted by Jason Pauli Jason Pauli wrote:

I always threw better with whippy handles.  I think that your technique modifies itself timing-wise to whatever you're practicing with.  I used PVC the last few years and when I got a hold of a stiff handle the way I moved changed.

It always seemd to me the best hammer throwers did better with stiff handles.  I forget what he threw but Ryan launched that Fair Hill heavy hammer with the shovel handle on it years ago.  Maybe the stiffer it is the less energy is lost.


OK, my engineer's hat is on here.  There is essentially no energy lost with either handle type (because the whippy handle is pretty much elastic, i.e., not lossy).

You could view all differences in hammer throwing as coming from the way force is transmitted from the hands to the hammer head.  The rest of the body's motion basically places the hands in position to put force on the hammer handle.  If a whippy handle is working for you, the reason probably has to do with the timing of your pull and the dynamics of the handle:  the slow part of your motion doesn't slow the head down as much as the fast part of your motion speeds it up.  Someone with a really clean motion is better at managing the hammer head, having little tendency to slow it down in one part of the motion.

On the rare occasions that a hammer throw has really clicked for me (always in practice with nobody else in sight), I felt like I could feel the head accelerate throughout the motion.  When you feel this, it's unmistakable:  it feels like you can make the head go as fast as you like, and the only reason you don't make it go a lot faster is because you're so surprised to feel this.  The frustrating part is that, knowing what it feels like to make a good throw doesn't seem to help you get back there on the next throw. 

-Wayne



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"We may be small, but we're slow." - MIT Rugby


Posted By: brandell
Date Posted: 4/26/05 at 3:03am
Originally posted by Roy Bogue Roy Bogue wrote:

Oh My God!!

Oh My God!

Oh My God!

Chill BITCH!

Your making us other panicy Hammer Throwers all friggin neurotic......Must let go of mind screw must let go!!!!!!

My hammer Sucketh as well.


That's not all I heard sucked. Oh wait that was Steve....



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Posted By: Borges
Date Posted: 4/26/05 at 4:50am
In my opinion whippy is better. Incidentally, the hammer that Ryan chucked for 141'+ on Sunday and which four guys put out past 130' had a seriously whippy handle (I threw it about an hour earlier). Now I'll give my reasons. First, stiff handles tend to be thick and heavy, whippy handles tend to be thin and light. The more weight you have in the head and out of the handle the further the hammer will fly. Wire hammer throwers pay big bucks for exotic titanium handles so that they can get more of the 16# out in the ball. Second, and in my opinion more importantly, whippy handles help with the delivery. When you finish the sweep on the last wind and transition to the delivery you are looking to get a whip action on the ball. That means you have to have your hips slightly ahead of the ball before you block with the left and lift. If the handle is stiff then the only way to do that is to drag the ball slightly which takes off radius and kills your throw. If the handle is whippy and elastic then you don't. You can definitely feel the difference. Finally, from a materials point of view whippiness implies elasticity which could indicate the ability for the handle to stretch just slightly which could conceivably add radius. You'd have to test that one in the lab but even a 1/2" of stretch would add serious distance.

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Cheers,

Carlos



"Live free or die"


Posted By: Deakion
Date Posted: 4/28/05 at 4:32pm
Yea I agree whipping handles as in PVC seem better to me as well I guess simply do to thats what I "we" are used too, Rattan is supposed to be better I know one AD in Texas swears by it 8), but us little guys got to get some whip to make it sail......or just by Rattan.

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Jonathan Irvin

And they shall know no fear.



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