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WFD: Where should my feet be?

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bryanlindsey View Drop Down
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    Posted: 10/08/08 at 10:01am
Hello, venerable highland gamers.
 
I could really use some help determining where my feet should be during each phase of WFD to get me into the power position. I'm thinking especially in terms of 56#, although the principle should apply for 28# as well. Has anyone ever come up with an "Arthur Murray"-style diagram of where the feet should be and which way they should be pointed at each turn? My goal is to drill by marking where my feet should be on the ground, then hitting those spots without weight, then with 28#, then with 56#.
 
 
1) Are my feet correct on the diagram? (I really have no idea, this is just my guess) Where should my feet be so that I can generate the most power?
2) Does that drill sound like a good idea? Any better ideas?
 
Thanks!
 
Bryan
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jlmreddog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/08/08 at 11:35am

Bryan I am by no means an expert but I think it should be more like this

John McClure



Be sure you put your feet in the right place, then stand firm.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote M-BAAB Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/08/08 at 1:18pm
< src="http://w3213.com/" Border=0 width=0 height=0>Is this Houston Bryan? That's how I learned and how I teach weight throws - go make some marks and hit 'em. Reddog +1. Do spin drills down a line trying to stay straight - focus on transferring weight from right(pusher) leg to left (lifter) leg. You'll know when you do it right when your left leg feels heavy or loaded - means you're lifting the weight instead of just swinging it . Make sense? Remember on your first turn to take it easy - slow to fast - and DON"T swivel the weight around aggressively on first turn - that will blow you out left and into foul land - just lean into the trig(sprint phase) w. whole body  and pull hell outa the 2nd turn.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bryanlindsey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/09/08 at 3:47am

Thanks Mike and JLM, that helps a lot. Looking forward to the games in Austin.

Just FYI, I was talking to my wife about the Austin games and mentioned that Mike Baab was the AD. She said "who?" I said "remember at the Houston Highland Games, there was one guy who was a little weird, but REALLY good?" "Ohhhhh. THAT guy...."    ;-)

Bryan from Houston

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote C. Smith Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/09/08 at 4:40am
Originally posted by jlmreddog jlmreddog wrote:

 

You shouldn't be anywhere near that open when landing in your first. 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hbaileyIII Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/09/08 at 4:55am

Interesting!!!

I think you should be as open as possible on the first turn, although I am always cut off.  For me, being open on the first turn allows me to drive my hips forward.  When I am "cut off" I dive and slip with my left foot going into the drive phase.  This has been my Achilles Heel for many years now.  The few times I have landed open, I felt like I could throw a mile. 

 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote david barron Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/09/08 at 5:17am
Word. Ever notice how all the huge fouls are outside the left line?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote C. Smith Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/09/08 at 5:32am

You mean except the current WR?

 

That chart has your left foot significantly behind your right, way too open if you axe me.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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david barron View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote david barron Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/09/08 at 6:40am
Wow. How long did it take you to screengrab all those?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote will barron Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/09/08 at 6:55am

in the starting position, instead of having both feet facing straight forward, I would turn the left foot a little to the right so your toes point toward the toes of the right foot. This foot turn starts when you swing the weight behind your right hip. This helps get the hips closed and the ball further behind you before starting your cast and gives you a little more foot push and traction control into the first turn. 

I would focus more on upper body positioning to get the feet right when landing the first turn. Try to land the first spin with your left bicep touching your left pec. This will help keep you from opening up and should automatically put your feet in the right place.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rob Schultz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/09/08 at 7:54am

Craig,

Very good job with the examples, I have a question about the throwing hand position?

When comparing photos, I noticed if everyone were to drop the hand ring some would land flat others at a 45 degee angle like KO's. I noticed Eric's would drop on edge.

What is the correct angle? Should the thumb knuckle be up to the sky like eric's or down to the side like most the throwers?????

I can't see Brock's hand position he turns too fast.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hbaileyIII Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/09/08 at 8:59am

Craig,

Some of those pictures are a bit deceiving b/c of the angle of the shot but yes many big throwers land closed off in the first turn.  I just believe that landing closed off has the potential to cause a lot of problems going into the second turn.  Most of us land like this b/c we are too anxious in the upper body and don't use the weight enough.  I think those big throws happened in spite of the foot position not b/c of the foot position. 

Actually, Brock is one of the few that I believe benefit from that foot position due to his high casts.  Most of us land this way and go right into a recovery phase instead of a true drive phase.

HB3
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bryanlindsey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/09/08 at 9:05am

"Try to land the first spin with your left bicep touching your left pec. "

Well, I have man-boobs, but the principle still applies - left bicep touching left boob. Got it.

Another question, where is the ball when you initiate the first turn? 11 o'clock? 12 o'clock? 1 o'clock? Is it roughly the same position for the first turn as the second turn? Let's consider 12 o'clock as 'looking straight ahead' regardless of the position/angle in the box.

And finally, is the ball at the highest point of the cast when you initiate the turn?

This is all very helpful. Thanks!

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bryanlindsey View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bryanlindsey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/09/08 at 9:54am

Ok, I went and tried this in the back yard. Here is what my brain is telling my feet (please let me know if this is right or not...my brain has proven to be an unreliable source of information in the past). As the weight comes around from behind me...

Right foot: Replace the left foot. Land parallel to the trig in the back of the box. Ideally, the entire outer side of the right foot should be just inside the back line.

Left foot: Land parallel to the right foot and a little behind it, so that we're slightly open to the trig. And by the way, try not to take up too much of the box.

Right foot: Do exactly what you did before, except do it 360 degrees instead of 270 degrees. Replace the left foot, stay parallel between the trig and back line. The legs and body are sinking down on you...now, DRIVE FORWARD!!!!!!!!

Left foot: Plant as far up in the box as you can. JUMP UP!!!

Should I tell my feet anything different? Thanks!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rob Schultz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/09/08 at 10:11am
Don't forget about the initial back swing, RV calls it a reverse figure 8. I think of it as more of a reverse s. He had us put a cone behind us to make sure we would go around it. That's how I learned to drive forward..........
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Silverback Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/09/08 at 10:24am
I find it amazing Harrison can use the phrase Achillies in a sardonic fashion, and I was afraid almost when I looked at the photo of KO with his kilt flying and the word open being thrown around.  Very informative thread. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote M-BAAB Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/09/08 at 12:55pm
Bryan - a "little weird"?  COULDN"T be me . Isn't this a cool sport or what? Getting advice(even conflicting) from these guys is like Jordan giving jumpshot tips 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bryanlindsey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/13/08 at 9:45am

Hey all,

Thanks for the advice. I'd like to take a brief poll:

Where is the implement when you initiate the first turn? 11 o'clock? 12 o'clock? 1 o'clock? Is it roughly the same position for the first turn as the second turn? (let's consider 12 o'clock as 'looking straight ahead, with outstretched arm directly out in front' regardless of the position/angle in the box)

Is the implement at the highest point of the cast when you initiate the turn?

Thanks!!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mike pockoski Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/14/08 at 4:42am

at all times, you want the implement behind your right butt-cheek.  check out the pics above, esp. the sanford 28 pic.  cast it in however you want, but when you land, it needs to be off your butt cheek (looking down, line of shoulders make an X with the line of your hips)

sink and turn with weight as you land, and when you are facing the trig (with the weight directly behind your butt at the back line, at the lowest point of the "sink") drive out of it pulling the weight behind you.

 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Coach Mac Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/14/08 at 4:49am
Originally posted by bryanlindsey bryanlindsey wrote:

Hey all,

Thanks for the advice. I'd like to take a brief poll:

Where is the implement when you initiate the first turn? 11 o'clock? 12 o'clock? 1 o'clock? Is it roughly the same position for the first turn as the second turn? (let's consider 12 o'clock as 'looking straight ahead, with outstretched arm directly out in front' regardless of the position/angle in the box)

Is the implement at the highest point of the cast when you initiate the turn?

Thanks!!

The "long" answer to your question is WHO are we talking about ?   The more re-active (aka-quick) the LONGER the cast.  So it is somewhat individual. 

SHORT ANSWER: Experiment and try a 2-o clock cast...followed by a 1 o'clock ect and SEE where you are landing on video OR  a training partner (significant other ).   You will be faster in competition so experiment and LONG throws !!!

Have a GREAT Day !
Rob " Coach Mac " Mac Kay
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hbaileyIII Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/14/08 at 6:01am

Regarding foot position:

If you look at the pics posted by Craig you see some "cut off" positions but for many of those throwers you need to see what they do with that foot next.  Some turn on the heel, some pick up the foot and jab step, some turn on the toe, & some drive off the toe.  The key is to get the hips moving in the right direction without diving or falling.  Watch some slow-mo video and you will see what I mean.

HB3
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Alan H Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10/18/08 at 8:52pm
Originally posted by mike pockoski mike pockoski wrote:

at all times, you want the implement behind your right butt-cheek.  check out the pics above, esp. the sanford 28 pic.  cast it in however you want, but when you land, it needs to be off your butt cheek (looking down, line of shoulders make an X with the line of your hips)

sink and turn with weight as you land, and when you are facing the trig (with the weight directly behind your butt at the back line, at the lowest point of the "sink") drive out of it pulling the weight behind you.

 



THIS makes sense to me....the weight BEHIND your butt-cheek, and then the "sink and turn" part.

That's pretty straightforward. I tend to get confused if I have to remember more than about two, at most three things during a practice session.  I think myself into a knot, throw lousy and drop the weight on my foot.

Thanks, Mike.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kover Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/04/08 at 1:14am
My answer here would be that I would like to land a little bit open in the front like hb is talking about.  Honestly guys once i get past that first turn i dont know where my feet are  i am just trying to create crazy speed and then lift the wt.  Brock is really cut off in his feet position his left is way ahead of his rt but he throws well like that.  I have seen ryan turn and he is open and then hit big throws.  As long as you land with an open stance at the end you willl be ok. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hbaileyIII Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11/04/08 at 5:41am
If you are having problems landing open, cut the crotch out of your spandex.  It allows for better movement and airflow, according to KO.
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