I suppose you could really argue specificity and determine you don't need to bend your knees any further than you do in any give throw/game situation.  That seems like a pretty short sighted approach imo.  

Be strong throughout a FULL range of motion and your body and athletics will thank you for it.  

I wonder if this is in reference to a recent sky high squat video I saw from a HG athlete?   

I don't throw any further squatting 600 pounds than I did when I squatted 500 pounds so I'm not going to worry about going any higher and focus on volume/speed

Now this has nothing to do with squat depth but IMO if you're squatting decent amounts of weight and making improvements, I'd stick with what you're doing. I know you're close to 500 pounds @ 250ish pounds of BW which is great. If you were someone like me who doesn't squat near enough for their BW, it could be something to consider to add #s to squat. 

I think speed/technique have more effect on the distance of your throws than poundage in the weight room WITHIN REASON obviously lol

Cant tell if I went down a separate rabbit hole but oh well, I like a good thread. 

http://www.nasgaweb.com/forum/john-smith-on-squats_topic6167.html" rel="nofollow - John Smith on Squats

 

I've never done a saftey squat before.  Neither gym I go to has one.

It's been debated on this site very often about the importance of strength.  I think the general consensus (at least form what I've read) is that technique trumps strength until your technique is good enough that strength matters.

You are an extremely technically sound thrower who is also strong.  Now just because you have training cycles where you are training lighter and throwing far doesn't mean that is the only reason you threw farther.  I would bet there are times you threw far when you were training heavy too.

I know that I don't need to get stronger.  My throws were big (for me) last season and I trained very little.  But I like to train, and train heavy, so I do it.

I think Craig's point of overthinking comes into play.  Nate is a pretty strong guy already.  If he squats 495 below parallel or 585 above parallel, would it really make that much of a difference?  Probably not.

It's not rocket science.  I've been pushing myself in the gym hard the last 3 months (hardest I've pushed in the last year) and all my lifts are going up.  Hell, my arms have even grown an inch.  LOL.

I am looking at my Tendo as I type this. I will be working with it late in the season this year, as I try to mix strength with bar speed. It will be interesting to see how it works, but I will be using it as part of my "peak" phase coming off a strength phase. Strength AND speed. Will be fun!  

My SSB "Hatfield" style is much higher than how I've been doing them this off-season. The traditional "Hatfield" style I did 455 x 5 quite easily at a much lower bodyweight and was nowhere near the strength levels I am now in the back squat. This off-season, I chose to swallow my ego and perform SSB Squats with my hands on the bar and my 1 rep max is 455 this way. I did this in hopes that by working my back more to maintain good posture with the SSB, my regular back squat might increase.

So to go along with what Jon had said, I am similar to his situation. My SSB Squat is 455 while my back squat is 490 (hopefully more by the end of the month). 

Does a lighter guy need to have that 500+ squat (or whatever we decide is strong) to throw the 56 with the big guys?

I'm barely 250 on a good day so my feeling is that my added strength may benefit my lack in size to counter the 56. Now I know I still have plenty of work to be done to improve my technique but I can't help but think the strength will allow me to be competitive until I become more technically sound. 

I love those cheaty squats.   They just seem to make you strong all over.  Always seemed to help my pull go up, too.

In terms of "strong enough to throw far" one rule of thumb is for athletes of a reasonable size to be able to squat TWICE their bodyweight below parallel AND to be able to squat their bodyweight at a velocity of 1 meter/second, which is a very fast squat. Smaller throwers would obviously have to do more than this to be competitive, while extremely large athletes could likely get away with less.

In terms of the issue of depth, there are conflicting schools of thought. The standard for many throwers seems to be more or less around parallel, but some go very deep and many elite throwers, especially the Germans and Russians, seem to mostly do half-squats or even higher, especially in the competitive period and the pre-competitive period. Bondarchuk's athletes rarely if ever go down to parallel, as he feels half-squats and even quarter squats are much more specific. The East Germans used to go down to just below parallel for the first half of the year and then always performed half squats to a bench for the second half.

If you believe in Block Periodization, you could do deeper squats during any strength blocks and then switch to half-squats for your speed/power blocks. 

Just my thoughts.

Meh its Chest and Bi's night at the gym tonight so wtf do I know?

I was just going for a push pull type setup.

Bad Brian... 

Please note that I said consistency.  Just like I said several posts ago.  I didn't say bigger throws.  

It's no secret, or surprise, that the biggest 56 throws have come from some really big dudes though.  

Ya, and I assume for you that your 56 became much more consistent at 42'+ when you were 290ish vs. 265lbs, amirite?

I'm picking up what your layin' down.  15-25 more strong Lbs on me would be great.  

I'm going to go eat now.

Size matters and this is a great point. 

But more generally it's crucial to note that improving any one of the three big components - technique, strength, and size - can improve your throws. The key to effective training is figuring out how to balance the three to get the most improvement for your specific situation and goals. Over the years that I've been involved my observation is that most throwers spend way too much time on strength and not nearly enough time on technique (I get it, I love the gym too.) I almost never see a top am or any pro that I think needs to prioritize strength. In my opinion, most of them have the strength to throw farther than they do. I see a fair number of folks who need more pudding in their britches (and a few who could use a fair bit less). 

If I could only give one single piece of advice for the rest of my life no matter who I was talking to it would be the best piece of advice I ever got (from Ali Gunn): "Throw more." That fits well with something Bob McKay told me many times: "throwing IS lifting."

What does this mean?  

 

I stretch it, roll it, massage it...no change.

 

I really don't think its tendinitis.  Perhaps a slight tear?  I dunno.  I have no symptoms until I have weight on my back and I get low.

 

I wonder if it is due to the orthodics I started using a few months ago.  My hips were jacked up and my body was out of line.  Maybe that part of my quad is being worked in ways it wasn't before? 

 

Maybe I'm just getting old lol.

Yes. 

My vote is a tear. I had one like it before and it sucked.

Point to where it hurts.

 

I'll give the leg extensions a try.  I havent done them in forever.  Sounds like a good idea.  Both quads are affected now, so I doubt its injury related.  Also, I am getting a DTM weekly, and am going to not squat for a couple weeks.  I'll hit DL pretty hard instead.

 

 

 

Nope.  Rest I must.

Anyways, off topic, but yeah, man. Sounds like you're due some rest and perhaps some quad work.