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jsully 
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 Posted: 6/11/12 at 1:08pm |
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in the meantime, something to work on for your hammer:
chop the hammer down on your right side. imagine you're pulling something down to you from overhead, like a rope pulldown or like you're pulling something with a pulley. Sink your hips hard and pull that hammer down into position on your right side. You'll notice it greatly increases the speed of the hammer. Don't bend your arms, sink your hips, that's what will generate the pull down. Give that a whirl at your next practice and let me know how it goes.
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Lance Creed
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Joined: 9/19/11 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 514 |
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Posted: 6/12/12 at 10:40am |
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Weights 6.12.12 Early morning gym session. Throwing later today. Weights: Jobes Front Squats 2x8x135, 175x3, 225x5, 245x3, 275x6 Bench 2x8x135, 175x3, 225x5, 245x3, 275x3 Good Mornings 3x10x225 BB Rows 3x10x245 Dips 3x10 Front squats still give me problems with the rounding forward issue. I did better today than I expected with them, but need to improve my form. Bench sucked, shoulder was fine but not as strong as I want to be. |
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Lance Creed
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Posted: 6/12/12 at 10:42am |
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Will keep this in mind tonight when I throw. I plan on working hammers mostly tonight. It seems like whatever I was doing to get speed on the ball before has completely went away. I will take video and post it so that I can get some advice as to whether I am doing what you say.
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Lance Creed
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Posted: 6/13/12 at 1:51am |
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Throwing 6.12.12
Got out there this evening to practice, tired legs and all. Not too bad of a showing, but not great either. Throws: LHammer - 1 wind x 5 (a few in the 67-68 ft range), bunch of full throws (best of 83+) HWFD - standing throws x 3 (best of 16’6”), 1 turns x 3 (best of 20+) LWFD - full throws x 5 (best of 52+) Started getting the feel for hammer towards the end. Looking at the video I still am not extending at all, but nonetheless I do feel a little better tonight. HWFD was horrible, but I haven’t touched one since Vegas and I am just trying to get used to it again. Will keep working it. Another good night on light weight. Video coming later, need to go to bed. |
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Lance Creed
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Posted: 6/13/12 at 9:15am |
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video from last night's practice
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Lance Creed
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Posted: 6/14/12 at 10:50am |
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Weights 6.13.12 Early morning gym session. Tired but thanks to some jack3d I woke up just in time. Weights: Jobes Deads 135x5, 225x5, 255x3, 315x5, 355x3, 405x4 Push Press 2x5x95, 3x115, 5x155, 3x165, 6x185 RDL 3x10x225 Chins 3x10 DB curls / 1 arm extensions super set 3 sets x 10 50# db /30# db Happy with the deads, I was scheduled for 395 but figured I would just go for 405. Shoulder did fine during presses so that’s good. Next week is deload week then on to another 5-3-1 cycle. |
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Lance Creed
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Posted: 6/14/12 at 10:59pm |
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Throwing 6.14.12
Great night throwing. Put a ton of work into the hammer and was happy to have a night, with the exception of my opening warm up and the throw I grounded, where everything was over 80 feet. I hope this points to things heading in the right direction once again. Throws: LHammer - 10+ throws, 3 over 86’ LWFD - full throws x 6 (best 53’3” pr) Braemar - 5 throws (best 30’5” pr) OStone - 5 MSA (best 37+) So happy to go over 30’ on Braemar, been a long time coming. Also really happy with LWFD again almost every throws was over 50’ with the exception of my opening throw. I was working on my footwork on OStone and although tired, I still felt really good about it. Had one I really got a hold of but lost track of the mark and took the lower mark at 37’. Hammers weren’t great but so much better than they have been for the last month. I was actually feeling when to pull on the catch tonight and am working on getting longer. Video will come later after the battery charges on my camera. Unfortunately it gave out after LWFD… |
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Lance Creed
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Posted: 6/15/12 at 10:47am |
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Vid from last night.
On hammer, I can see that I am not extended as far as it feels like I am extending. Should I be trying to reach more with the far shoulder to keep my arms long? I get really unstable when I try that, but is fixing the instability issue just a matter of getting lower? On wfd, I think I can get lower. But I still do not land opened up. I do 1 turn drills, but am not really opened up on those either. Not sure how to fix that... I bet if I could get opened up I would get a few more feet.
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jsully
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I drive to zero, biatch! Joined: 9/13/10 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2817 |
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Posted: 6/15/12 at 12:12pm |
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send me a PM on facebook with the video link. I forget to look back a lot of times and I can't view the video on my work computer. or better yet, just text it to me. |
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Lance Creed
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Posted: 6/17/12 at 4:38pm |
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Throwing 6.17.12
Sunday morning practice. Worked on hammers mostly. Throws: LHammer - lots of 1 turns (72-74 range), 2 turns (80-82 range), full throws (best 86+) HWFD - standing throws, 1 turns (best of 20’) LWFD - 2 turns (best of 52+) Braemar Stone - throws (best of 32+ pr) Was really getting tired after all the hammer throws and the hwfd and my lwfd numbers started to suffer after a few throws. The Braemar PR came out of nowhere, basically took 3 or 4 throws and decided I would go for it on 1 and call it a day and ended up hitting a big pr! |
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Stanley
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Joined: 3/05/11 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 225 |
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Posted: 6/17/12 at 11:41pm |
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Braemar @ 32' is awesome! Sounds like your shoulder is feeling better.
I hate light hammer! I have been getting 75'+ consistently with the heavy, but I can't break 90-91' with the light. I guess I am trying to force the issue and my orbit just isn't smooth. Looks like your practices are going well. |
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Lance Creed
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Posted: 6/18/12 at 9:03am |
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Thanks and I still feel like the spot must have been off or something! Hammers haven't moved for me in months and my back went out the week I finally saw improvement. Of course, I lost it again after coming back. Regardless it seems I am improving in just about every event right now (other than hammers) and I couldn't be happier. I am beginning to think it is time to bust out blades because I don't know what else to do... I'm telling you, the Jobes work makes all the difference. I can't thank you enough for showing those to me. |
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jsully
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I drive to zero, biatch! Joined: 9/13/10 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2817 |
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Posted: 6/18/12 at 10:32am |
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ok.. so I saw your one turns and I saw your hammers. I don't remember the fulls but here are my thoughts. On the 1 turn/sprint drills, you aren't kicking the weight out at all. So your orbit is more like an ellipses, rather than an spherical orbit. Think circle, not egg shaped. When the weight is behind you, you're just letting it fall into it's low point, which is fine, but it's a very narrow orbit. Kick it out to the side, then let it fall. Think about driving diagonally to the left side of the trig. I used to drive too hard to the left side, so I had to try to drive straight. Everyone has different cues and everyone throws a bit differently so what worked for me might not work for you, hence why I'm telling you to think about sprinting a little to the left. That'll get your left leg around to hopen your hips up for a big finish. Remember to wait until the weight gets to your right hip/knee. Don't sprint too soon. That's an issue I'm having right now that I need to fix. On your hammers, there's no hip movment. The entire throw is with your arms/lats. You've got to loosen up, use your hips. Think of a hula hoop. As the weight is in front of you, going to your left side, you want to counter your hips to the right. That's what I mean by drive the right knee. That's going to pus your hips the opposite directly so when the weight starts heading up the left side, your hips are going to pull it to the right. As the ball is rounding behind you and starting to sink, you need to TWIST YOUR UPPER BODY and sink hard, like you're pulling on a rope. That will increase the ball speed and essentially you'll be pulling the hammer down. So your hips are always in the opposite directly as the ball. As the ball is behind you, your hips are forward, knees out over your toes and you're upper body is bent backwards, high and long. As the ball is rounding your right side, you'r sinking your hips. Naturally you'll sink them to the left to counter and maintain your balance. Then again as the ball is going to your left you're going to be pushing your hips to the right. Get it? I still can't hula hoop to this day, but it's a reference point still. Try to breathe OUT before you pull on the hammer. Get it nice and high, then let it drop. Then think about using your hips to move it, not your arms. Don't worry about all of it at once. Think about driving the hips right at first. When you can do that, then think about pre-turning your torso to catch the ball, then just let it drop. When you can do that, then add in the active sink/chop with the hips. One step at a time. Hope all that helps some. Sorry if I caused an overload, haha. |
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Lance Creed
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Posted: 6/18/12 at 12:49pm |
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Ugh, think hula hoop? You know I can't make one of those work right?
I see what you mean and have for a while with the hips though. I guess making my body actually do it is the trick. Every time I try to reach back further or move my hips more I start losing my footing, usually my left foot at the top of the wind. I will throw light hammer tonight and will get more video. Tonight I will try working on getting my hips to counter and sink with the weight like you described. As for hwfd, I felt like I couldn't lift the damn thing yesterday. I don't know if I was just fatigued but it owned me like the first time I picked it up last year. I didn't do any full throws after standing throws and 1 turns kicked my ass.
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Lance Creed
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Posted: 6/18/12 at 10:52pm |
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Throwing 6.18.12
After work session. Broke my hammer handle on my second throw so mostly a stones session. Throws: LHammer - 1 winds, 2xthrows (81+, 82+) OStone - toeboard drills, standing throws (best of 36+ pr), MSAs (best of 38+) Was still warming up when I busted the hammer so nothing to really
see there. Stones went well for the most part, I was hitting 35-36+
consistently when my old pr was in 34 something. MSA kind of felt like a
mess, but still managed to get in the mid 38+ range. Fouled most throws but not too concerned about it. |
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jsully
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I drive to zero, biatch! Joined: 9/13/10 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2817 |
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Posted: 6/18/12 at 11:47pm |
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hammers looked solid... as always, get longer.. regardless, much better hip action and good job turning to catch the hammer
stones look pretty good.. try to get that left around faster, that's where all your torque is coming from, fast left, hold the upper, explode
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Stanley
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Joined: 3/05/11 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 225 |
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Posted: 6/19/12 at 5:58pm |
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I have been waiting on the blades until I hit 80' HH and 100' LH. But yeah I have been thinking the same thing. Although I think all of my throws have suffered because I have mostly been training two days per week all throws and not getting enough throws in each event. After SD and until Flag, I am going to experiment with throwing 1 hour in each event for heavy events (1 hour x 1 day/event) and 2 hours per event light events (1 hour x 2 days/event) hopefully getting more consistent and better coordination. I am happy to help. I would say that the same fix doesn't always work for me. Prior to my last rotator flare up I used Cuban Presses to work through the issue, and it worked. However, this last time they weren't working, so the doc prescribed the jobes. Cuban's are like snatches, but you are just using the rotators to lift the weight. My brother has tried the jobes and they aren't working for him. Cuban's worked for him too once, but no more. I am committed to not slacking off this time. |
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jsully
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Posted: 6/19/12 at 7:00pm |
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more time throwing, less time lifting..
the gym only translates so much.. I'm lighter and weaker than I was 3 months ago, but I'm throwing a good deal farther. I lift 3x/week and throw 4-5x/week.
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Stanley
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Posted: 6/19/12 at 7:41pm |
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That is true for me. For sure. I am at gym 2x and throw 4x. That's all I have time for, and two of those are mixed days.
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Lance Creed
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Posted: 6/20/12 at 12:19am |
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Threw then headed straight to the gym for a workout tonight so two posts in one. Throwing: LHammer - 1 winds x 5 (3 @ 79+), 2 winds x 5 (2 @ 82+), full throws x 10 (best of 83+) LWFD - standing throws x 5 (best of 35+), full throws x 5 (best of 55’) Hammer was a good news/bad news/good news night. The 79+ throws were beyond my 1 wind pr by 6 feet. The 2 winds were also multiple feet prs. The full throws not so much. I was able to sink my hips and “pull the rope” on 1 winds and 2 winds which was new to me. Accordingly, I threw better 1 and 2 winds than I ever had before. When it came to full throws I wasn’t able to get into position to do that on the full throws. After thinking about it though I think I need to slow down the first wind and just worry about getting into a dynamic start of a 2 wind delivery, if that makes sense. LWFD pr was huge. I was exhausted and had gone 48, 50, 53, and 49 on
my throws and did not want to leave with a sub-50 throw so I decided to
try one more really focusing on a tighter cast and quicker feet. It was
one of those that I knew was better than all my previous throws the
moment it left my hand and I am thrilled to hit that number now as it
was my goal to get to 55’ by the Tucson games in November. Now I have to
shoot for 60’ Weights: Deload night so pretty easy on the weights. Front Squat 5x175, 5x225, 5x255 Bench 5x135, 5x185, 5x225 Good Mornings 3x10x185 BB Rows 3x10x185 Close Grip Bench 3x10x135 Just wanted to get the blood moving while letting my body recover from the latest 5-3-1 cycle. |
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jsully
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Posted: 6/20/12 at 12:37am |
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looking better.. get that left around on those weights, it's slow and clumsy.. needs to be fast and deliberate.
hammers looking good too, though towards the last couple you had lost all hip movement. big PRs tonight, glad the work is paying off buddy that's a video from hammers on monday and stones today. I slowmo'd my last heavy hammer throw that was 96ft. Watch my hips, my right knee, my extension and how my torso turns to catch the ball.
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Lance Creed
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Posted: 6/20/12 at 8:54am |
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I am slow and clumsy ;) No seriously, I will continue to work on getting that left around faster and more deliberately. It will come I'm sure.
Thanks, next time I am going to vid my 1 winds and 2 winds. Things were going much better on those.
I see what you are doing, but have to find a way to get my body to do that. It's taken a year to figure out when to pull on wfd so maybe extending/bending/sinking/pulling without falling over on hammers will happen soon. I think I need to take the same approach that has improved my wfd so much (which you have already worked on with me) and that's deconstructing the throw in drills and working it backwards from the big pull/release on the 1 wind drill all the way to the full throw. |
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Lance Creed
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Posted: 6/21/12 at 10:35am |
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Weights 6.21.12 Deload session. These things are great! Weights: Cuban Presses 3x10xbar Deads 135x8, 175x 5, 225x5, 265x5 Presses 2x5x95, 115x5, 135x5 RDL 3x10x205 DB Shoulder Presses 3x10x50s Hammer Curls 3x10x50s 1 Arm DB Extensions 3x10x30 Tried Cuban Presses in lieu of Jobes work. Thought they were challenging but seemed to work well. Will probably keep these in the long term shoulder rehab/prehab routine. Otherwise not much to report here, light day worked up a light sweat. Wish I was heading to Vista this weekend, but travelling isn't always easy to do. Will be ready for Flagstaff. |
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Lance Creed
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Posted: 6/21/12 at 10:41pm |
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Throwing 6.21.12
Got out there in threw in the 108 degree heat today. Decided to stick with hammer since that is the event that has been struggling the most lately. LHammer - 1 winds x 5 (best of 80’6” pr), 2 winds x 5 (best of 85’3” pr) and full throws x 20 (best of 88’1”) Overall did ok on these. I was way more consistent that I have been in a couple of months with the full throws. Other than 2 throws below 85’, both at 83+, everything was 85’ or higher so I am kind of happy. I would have liked to hit a pr on full throws considering how well the 1 and 2 winds went. Still need to figure out how to extend my arms without going ass over teakettle too. |
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Lance Creed
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Posted: 6/24/12 at 6:38pm |
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Throwing 6.24.12 Sunday practice in the heat and humidity. Kind of ran out of gas quickly and practice was so so. Forgot the camera so no video either. Throws: OStone - toe board drills, standing throws, South Africans, MSAs (best was 38+) Hwfd - standing throws, 2 turns (best 20+) Lwfd - 2 turns (best of 50+) Light Hammer - 1 winds (80+), 2 winds (83+), full throws (85+) Heavy Hammer - full throws (66+) Humidity was way up this morning and I lost my grip on more than a few hammer throws. Pretty happy on my hwfd because I was actually able to do the 2 spin without losing my balance on the sprint for once. I didn’t have any pull to throw the thing but at least I felt better on the cast and sprint. I plan on putting lots of work into it the next few months. |
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Lance Creed
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Posted: 6/24/12 at 7:07pm |
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Thinking of formalizing a practice schedule.
This week I am going to try:
Sunday - full practice (would like to get this to a competition style day - warmup 3x every event) Monday - both wfds Tuesday - both stones Thursday - both hammers Does that make sense or should it be something like this? Sunday - full practice Monday - Braemar/lwfd Tuesday - heavy hammer/ostone Thursday - hwfd/light hammer |
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jsully
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I drive to zero, biatch! Joined: 9/13/10 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2817 |
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Posted: 6/25/12 at 11:43am |
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I think it just depends on how you learn.
I like to work the shit out of one event, once a week, then touch on it again later. I find that if I train for an 90 minutes with one event. I make a huge breakthrough right at the 85 minute mark.. hahahahahaha.. From there, I'll probably do the event again later in the week. Some weeks I dial back one event, some weeks I work them more.
this past couple weeks I haven't thrown on saturdays so I throw my 4th day during the week. Last week went:
monday = hammers
tuesday= stones
wednesday = weights
thursday = stones/hammer
this week will be
monday = weights
tuesday = stones
wednedsay = hammers
thursday = lwfd/ostone
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Lance Creed
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Posted: 6/25/12 at 12:12pm |
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I kind of feel like working the crap out of 1 event is better for me. Although I can't imagine a long day with the hwfd. I can throw lwfd for over an hour, but 10 reps with hwfd might kill me. But then again, I am really bad with the heavy because I don't get much practice time in with it. I have one on the way from Landrich, so I will get plenty of reps soon. Thanks for the input.
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jsully
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Posted: 6/25/12 at 12:55pm |
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you get used to it, especially if you use a strap to take some pressure off your grip.
today is wfd, but I'll probably throw hwfd exclusively today. 8-10 one turns, then 15-20+ full throws. goal is 85% = 37 1/2 ft as effortlessly as possible. I want to really feel the sink and drive..
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Lance Creed
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Posted: 6/26/12 at 1:06am |
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Throwing 6.25.12
Mostly a HWFD night. Hit a good spot where everything was in line for once and had my balance coming out of the sprint for the most part. If I could have maintained my grip I think I had a few really good throws on the way that unfortunately went out the side with the added speed. Throws: HWFD - 5 x standing (best of 17+), 5 x 1 turn (best of 22’1” pr), 10 x 2 turns (3 @ 22’) LWFD - 5 x standing, 5 x something Jose made up, 5 x 1 turn, 7 x 2 turns (best at 50’) Light weight was off but I attributed it to being really tired from the heavy weight throws. The good news is that, for once, heavies went kind of well. Almost all of my 2 turn throws were 21+, with 3 at 22’. I had 2 I couldn’t hold on to in a row that I felt had some sauce on them coming out of the sprint. My hand is torn to high hell from tonight and I am feeling beat up too. Overall I’m kind of happy with the results. I think next time I will cut down on the number of standing and 1 turn throws and maybe do six 2 turn throws for each implement. Maybe 3, 3, and 6 or something to that effect. |
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jsully wrote: